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Shoulder and Crotch straps
Comfort or Dis-comfort?
fixers 2007-02-01, 14:27 #1
Member since Jun 2005 · 58 posts · Location: The Hague
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Subject: Shoulder and Crotch straps
Today I've noticed this corset on ebay:
[Image: http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h187/fixertje/Diversen%20fora/e6_1_b.jpg]
(You can find the actual auction HERE.)

The corset an sich is not that special. However it has a remarkable set of shoulder straps pulling the shoulders down and backwards. In addition ther are two straps that gou between the legs pulling or keeping the whole corset down. The combination of these straps make that you can quite fiercely apply 'vertical compression'.

But I'm wondering how comfortable would that be? I've always been intrigued by and interested in shoulder straps on a corset. And I am seriously considering getting another corset wit shoulder straps, and maybe even crotch straps. (But that would be worn under normal clothing, not on display over normal clothing as my current corset is). But how comfortable is such a garmen with all those extra straps? Is it wearable during daily routine or is such a strap arrangement more for 'in the bedroom'?
This post was edited on 2007-02-01, 14:31 by fixers.
Lady Annalai 2007-02-01, 18:50 #2
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Hi,

Looking at the design of the shoulderstraps I think they do not work for pulling the shoulders backwards only down. For pulling them backwards the straps needs to go around the arm under the armpit and back I think but I have not tried this design so I am not sure.

 I do not think they are very uncomfortable to wear if not pulled very tightly so it all depends on how tight you pull them. I wear shoulderstraps 23/7 and I can not wear them tightly laced while driving or cleaning for example it is also difficult to raise the arms up for brushing the hair for example when they are very tightly laced so for daily wear I do not pull them very tightly any longer but mine I can not remove from my corset.  So for periods of training they work great I think but they can be difficult to wear and hide under normal clothes in daily life. I got used to my shoulderstraps very quickly.

My new corset has no shoulderstraps. I now think it is better to have a loose shoulderbrace insted or a special trainingcorset with shoulderstraps and not wear it daily.
The shoulderstraps I have on my corset does not fully work as they should they do not pull the shoulders backwards as much as I had wished and I always need to dress so I am hiding them.

Scroll down to the middle of this page to read some more about my shoulderstraps and if you follow the link you find more information about shoulderstraps.
http://www.staylace.com/albertcst/index9.html

Annalai
Lady Annalai 2007-02-01, 19:18 #3
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I forgot to say I can not pull and knot the shoulderstraps behind my back on my own so when I do not have help I knot them in the front but still I can pull them very tight for training this way.

The shoulderstraps are never removed so on all dressed pictures I am wearing shoulderstraps underneath and sometimes a bit show. I have sometimes got both strange looks and questions about it.
Peter O. 2007-02-01, 22:24 #4
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In reply to post #1
Subject: Links
The principle of the first Tightlacing in old days was as used a corset by Shoulder straps. The variations are great.

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:30901CORSET_BARATd…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redresseur_corset

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Shoulder-Corset

http://haabet.dk/patent/Lung_Expander.html
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corsetmaster (Moderator) 2007-02-02, 04:58 #5
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Quote by Peter O.:
The principle of the first Tightlacing in old days was as used a corset by Shoulder straps. The variations are great.

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:30901CORSET_BARATd…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redresseur_corset

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Shoulder-Corset

http://haabet.dk/patent/Lung_Expander.html

That sounds nice Peter O, and you have showed these links before. Can you explain more about your practical experience with these?
Peter O. 2007-02-02, 11:06 #6
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Quote by corsetmaster:
Can you explain more about your practical experience with these?

Yes, but I have a theory: There are two fundamental types of tighten shoulder-straps. One which push the shoulder behind and One which push the shoulder down. Only the push down of shoulders give sense by corsets, because the neck and bosom been bring out of low narrow shoulders. The shoulders been narrower when the collarbone been sloping, because the chest and sternum go up. But I see I have need of more practical experience,  because the collarbone been sloping.

Image of a woman by sloping shoulders and long neck.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/TheWorl…
The strops of her (ordinary day) corset is not visible, but corsets without shoulder-straps is first know from 1849 and first common about 1860.

1. Practical: The more stiff shoulder-straps, the lesser press on the shoulders. Theory: The soft strap lace the  shoulder and the stiff ring rest on on the shoulder.
1b. Theory: The stiff shoulder-straps have need of a pads (That Theory looks confirmed by images of old shoulder-straps).

2. Practical: The shoulder-straps had need to go close to the neck but down between the arm and breast, and farther down under the arm (to the loin).

3. Practical: The strengthening of shoulder-straps by fabric by spiral spring, give a great work by a poor result. Theory: Only stiff leather (or thick plastic) is suitable to for shoulder-straps.  That Theory looks confirmed by photos of old shoulder-straps.

4. The shoulder-straps fasten best in the hole to the lace,  because they spread the load.

5. It is important as woman is self-dressing.

If that was easy, it was a matter of course.

Peter O.
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corsetmaster (Moderator) 2007-02-02, 11:26 #7
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I am not sure you understand my question.

Please elaborate more about the experiments and results you have achieve in real life. To me, all your thoughts, are no more than ideas. Ideas that you haven't tried in real life, on women. I hope, I am wrong about this, and want to know about your practical experiments, and your results.

That said, I also enjoy the results of using shoulder straps in combination with corsets, e.g. the aesthetic results.
fixers 2007-02-02, 13:03 #8
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To Annalai: Thank for your long and elaborate response. I've seen some quite interesting information in your post. Allow me to explain a bit about my personal ideas in corsetry: Tightlacing or large waist reductions are not my goal. I'm slim already and a boy so I do not want more than a few inches reduction. My goal is more in the correction of my posture: straight back and my shoulders backwards (instead of my normal posture: slouching forward). In addition of some added back support during the day. (I'm currently applying for a job in a cookware shop: standing all day). And the feel of wearing a corset of course. I especially enjoyed the info of putting it on yourself as I have no partner to lace me up.

To Peter O.: I'm getting the idea that you are using every post to demonstrate that you have an extensive library of links and documents about corsets. You did not added any useful information in this topic. Clearly you've totally missed the fact that I'm a boy and not a girl, I've made that fact clear in several other posts on this forum. Frankly: I find your posts rather annoying and un-informative.
Lady Annalai 2007-02-12, 18:40 #9
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Hi,

I saw this unusual corset with crotch straps similar to the one on the picture.
A combination corset-flying harness for an Aerialist, 1890's
Scroll down to the middle of the page.
http://www.costumes.org/travel/00pages/uktour/2002uktourmo…

Annalai
Roger Conroy (Administrator) 2007-02-13, 06:19 #10
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My 2c worth:
Shoulder straps are useful if correctly designed, made and applied.
Crotch straps seem to only be "useful" in a BDSM sense! Ouch!

Annalai, thats a very nice site you've pointed out. Thanks!
Its a pity they don't have more technical details on the items shown.
KEEP TIGHT!!!
fixers 2007-02-17, 07:43 #11
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In reply to post #9
Quote by Lady Annalai on 2007-02-12, 18:40:
A combination corset-flying harness for an Aerialist, 1890's
Scroll down to the middle of the page.
http://www.costumes.org/travel/00pages/uktour/2002uktourmo…

That's a very interesting corset. Both in design as in function. Pitty there aren't any images of the back, but at the top back you can see something that looks to me like a hook to attach a hoisting cable. I've worn climbing harnesses before, both the step-in harness as the full-body type and being suspended in those isn't all that uncomfortable as it looks at first glance. But being suspended by a hook attached to the back of your corset, I'm not shure about the comfort in that.

In any case looking at this corset I'd say that crotch straps can be functional, but I'm unshure of the comfort they'll provide. For my next corset I seriously getting a high back with shoulderstraps... But I'll leave the crotchs strap be. (or at best have them detachable).
Peter O. 2007-02-18, 16:03 #12
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In reply to post #2
Quote by Lady Annalai on 2007-02-01, 18:50:
My new corset has no shoulderstraps. I now think it is better to have a loose shoulderbrace insted or a special trainingcorset with shoulderstraps and not wear it daily.
A logical thinking say: Corset and Shoulderbrace is different, and a combination is a corset by shoulderbrace or a shoulderbrace by very broad straps, as it is covering the ribs. A shoulderbrace-corset have need of a separate Girdle-Corset by high front, under the chest.
 
Quote by Lady Annalai on 2007-02-01, 18:50:
The shoulderstraps I have on my corset does not fully work as they should they do not pull the shoulders backwards as much as I had wished and I always need to dress so I am hiding them.
Annalai
The shoulders sit on the collarbones which sit on the breast-bone, and you is breathing by the breast-bone. Do that work well if you pull the shoulders backwards?
By the breathing the chest the journals of the spinal column go up and down, but will the journals hit the shoulder blades?

Can you test these shoulder-braces?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redresseur_corset#Alternative
Note! they had need of stiffness in a circle round each shoulder, and needs pads.

If somebody will like to test a shoulderbrace-corset, I think this patent is the best,
http://www.haabet.dk/patent/GB1890_16212/index.html
ugly? Nobody make a ugly corset without comfort.

Peter O.
Peter O. 2007-02-18, 20:32 #13
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In reply to post #7
Quote by corsetmaster on 2007-02-02, 11:26:
Please elaborate more about the experiments and results you have achieve in real life. To me, all your thoughts, are no more than ideas. Ideas that you haven't tried in real life, on women.

The theory and the practical, is a whole. The practical can live fine without theory, if it has got a strong living tradition.

But have the corsetry a strong living tradition? No.

Why had so few of the 70 pin-ups on staylace.com a serious waist? They are all your girl friends. How had you do not laced they serious?

We had need of a higher level of corset theory, or corset been never common.

People talk about Victorian-corset, but the best corset for modern is from the short era 1905-1908, then the skirt was light and the waist continuously thin.

Peter O.
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corsetmaster (Moderator) 2007-02-25, 10:36 #14
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Why had so few of the 70 pin-ups on staylace.com a serious waist? They are all your girl friends. How had you do not laced they serious?
I believe some of the pinups on staylace.com have a "serious" waist. According to their pinups profiles: Annalai has a waist of 46cm, Lady Asenath has a waist of 19", Lacie is 43 cm, Michaela at 19"-20" and Snowball is 20". Excuse me, but I think that is pretty "serious".
Thanks for calling all of them my "girlfriends", but I am sure they disagree. :-)

We had need of a higher level of corset theory, or corset been never common.
I agree that SOME theory is good, but I disagree that it alone will make the use of corsets more widespread. I believe that to make the wear of corset more common, the effort to purchase and wear one, most be lower. And this wear will not be the tight-lacing kind, at least not to begin with. In many peoples mind, the corset has a strong association with sexuality and BDSM. The corset does have that association, but not solely that. The corset is also worn as a daily undergarment, like panties and bras. Emphasizing the use of corsets as "normal" underwear, will be more beneficial in increasing the use of corsets, than having some advanced corset theory.

You still havent elaborated about the experiments and results you have achieve in real life.
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